Why don't we teach personal finance in school? - Page 4

gt0163c · 01-15-2008, 07:21 AM

Somewhere along the way in school I learned how to balance a checkbook, how interest works and such. I think these were mostly from word problems in my math classes (public school, I'm 32, so this was mostly late 80's, maybe early 90's for high school). I also remember a few comments about various personal finance things and issues with debt that were made by teachers during lectures. This was probably in my economics and possibly American history classes. So, financially, I was pretty well off. I learned a lot of life skills (cooking, cleaning, basic sewing and such) at home just by helping my Mom out. In fact, I took over most of the household cooking my last two years in high school. I like to cook. Mom doesn't. And Dad made sure I could change a tire, check the oil in the car, etc not long after I got my driver's license. However, I do remember teaching a number of my friends in college how to do some basic cooking, sewing a button on, ironing, etc.

What I would have found informative is a class on how insurance works, how to rent an apartment, how to set up utilities, what to expect when buying a car and all those other things that I ended up doing for the first time on my own within a year so of getting out of college. I'm not certain exactly how to teach that type of stuff, but if there was a way, it would have been useful to me and many of my friends.

I think probably the best way to learn these type of lessons is for kids to be involved in the management of the household when they're growing up. Looking back I can now see that household chores are as much about learning how to run a household as they are about sharing the workload.

Ginger · 01-15-2008, 10:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Honest Dollar

schools make this class mandatory for all students and train their teachers to teach the class effectively

That's exactly what they need to do.

beansac · 01-15-2008, 05:51 PM

In my school, it is mandatory, but the teachers include

1) A man who doesn't know the difference between their and they're, which is the best way to explain his personal finance knowledge.

2) A man who put himself into so much debt he had to move back in with his parents, then teaches finance, and doesn't know what volatility is ("does it mean disgusting" and that isn't an anecdote.) He didn't know that America didn't always have an income tax, or that the money supply is controlled by the government (and private banks.)

Unfortunately, there isn't much financial motivation to transfer from being a financial advisor to being a public school teacher. Most are busy making money.

As the quote goes "All the astronauts are in space."

gspencer · 01-15-2008, 10:19 PM

Hmm... my school was very different than most I guess because we did learn about finances in school! Not that I think every student got as much out of it as I did... or that I remember everything from them... but I do distincly remember taking the classes.

The first class was half a semester and attached to the Driver's Education class (which everyone signs up for, obviously). We learned how to look for a job in the classifies, write a resume and apply for a job. I think we even talked about how to ask for a certain amount of compensation on how to get more (ie: when applying for a standard retail Mall job, put a higher amount than minimum wage and say that it's negotiable). In this class, we also learned how to balance a checkbook. There was probably more, but that's all I can remember.

And then the second class that I think is actually a required class (at least in California) for seniors is Economics. Now it might have just been my teacher, who I recall as being very strict but very good... but we actually learned about bonds and stocks and micro and macro-economics. I even remember a project where we all got a certain amount of class "money" (imaginary money), something like $500 and we could invest in any stocks we'd like. Then over the course of a couple weeks we tracked the progress of our stocks and figured out how much we were actually "making". I think the winners (whoever made the most at the end of the specified period) got something ... extra credit points or a giftcard or something.

So maybe my high school was just good about teaching some financial basics, because it doesn't sound like a lot of people had much at their high school.

stormy · 01-20-2008, 01:34 PM

I think personal finance should be taught in schools simply because so many adults are lacking the basics. That said, I think schools are expected to teach too much and a lot of things should be taught at home. If we expect schools to teach math, science, social studies, sex ed, personal finance, health, etc sooner or later we need to send kids to school for longer periods of time or on weekends or during the summer.

I think in general kids learn better from watching their parents do things than from sitting in a class room so we should all try to teach them personal finance at home and we should teach them at school so everybody gets the basics.

Linsey Knerl · 01-20-2008, 02:19 PM

I think they should teach more PF in schools. When I was in HS (over 10 years ago), they touched on it in a "modern Living" class -- fancy word for Home Ec. It was a goof-off class to pass the Senior year away. We discussed how to write a check one day, and other than that, it was how to cook from a recipe and how to put a condom on a banana. I certainly think if schools can hand out birth control, it wouldn't be out of line to show them the basics of interest rates and EFT deductions.

That's why we are trying to be more diligent about it with our home school curriculum. There is no way I'm letting my kids find out about the pitfalls of bad money decisions on a trial basis. I hope that if schools can't find it in their budgets that a good non-profit will step up and do something for the school-age children.

72Tiger · 01-20-2008, 02:29 PM

Finance is such a personal subject. Not as much as religion, but close, I would think. What version would you want taught in school? What if they taught your kids something you disagreed with?

That said, it would be nice if it could be done - I learned too many financial lessons the hard way.

Julie Rains · 01-20-2008, 06:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Linsey Knerl

I hope that if schools can't find it in their budgets that a good non-profit will step up and do something for the school-age children.

Several years ago, I was on the advisory board of the a local money management center that offered PF training to community members and youth. The program was led by a person who had her doctorate in Financial Education and was associated with the Cooperative Extension office, and funded by the federal and state governments. But funding was cut and that position/center (basically a one-person show) was eliminated.

Still it looks like there are still some government resources for youth education
Cooperative Extension Youth Financial Education

I'll have to check them out.

Anthony Marrone · 01-20-2008, 07:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Linsey Knerl

I think they should teach more PF in schools. When I was in HS (over 10 years ago), they touched on it in a "modern Living" class -- fancy word for Home Ec. It was a goof-off class to pass the Senior year away. We discussed how to write a check one day, and other than that, it was how to cook from a recipe and how to put a condom on a banana. I certainly think if schools can hand out birth control, it wouldn't be out of line to show them the basics of interest rates and EFT deductions.

That's why we are trying to be more diligent about it with our home school curriculum. There is no way I'm letting my kids find out about the pitfalls of bad money decisions on a trial basis. I hope that if schools can't find it in their budgets that a good non-profit will step up and do something for the school-age children.

This is the approach I am taking with my brothers. I went to private school my entire life (including private undergraduate and graduate facilities) and really have never been instructed on the basics of personal finance. At this point I'm not expecting any educational institution to provide to my family, what I feel I can do a far better job at.

I think that our society as a whole has created a culture where we sweep the basics of financial responsibility under the table in favor of materialism and "bling" (See, current subprime mortgage mess and coming economic doom). It should come as no surprise to any of us that schools are failing our students when it comes to teaching them to be responsible with their money. While it would be nice to see personal finance classes offered to students at all levels, it seems to be wishful thinking at this point.

khorrell · 01-27-2008, 10:33 AM

What a great post...this is a subject I am very interested in and I've learned a lot from reading your posts. It is clear that there are barriers to teaching pf in high school, particularly the AP, IB factor. I'm just appalled to hear that there are unqualified people teaching pf - exactly the opposite of useful. I look forward to reading more of this post!

01-20-2008, 01:34 PM	#35
stormy Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 6 Reputation: (10)	Yes and no I think personal finance should be taught in schools simply because so many adults are lacking the basics. That said, I think schools are expected to teach too much and a lot of things should be taught at home. If we expect schools to teach math, science, social studies, sex ed, personal finance, health, etc sooner or later we need to send kids to school for longer periods of time or on weekends or during the summer. I think in general kids learn better from watching their parents do things than from sitting in a class room so we should all try to teach them personal finance at home and we should teach them at school so everybody gets the basics.

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01-15-2008, 07:21 AM	#31
gt0163c Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Texas Posts: 244 Reputation: (33)	Somewhere along the way in school I learned how to balance a checkbook, how interest works and such. I think these were mostly from word problems in my math classes (public school, I'm 32, so this was mostly late 80's, maybe early 90's for high school). I also remember a few comments about various personal finance things and issues with debt that were made by teachers during lectures. This was probably in my economics and possibly American history classes. So, financially, I was pretty well off. I learned a lot of life skills (cooking, cleaning, basic sewing and such) at home just by helping my Mom out. In fact, I took over most of the household cooking my last two years in high school. I like to cook. Mom doesn't. And Dad made sure I could change a tire, check the oil in the car, etc not long after I got my driver's license. However, I do remember teaching a number of my friends in college how to do some basic cooking, sewing a button on, ironing, etc. What I would have found informative is a class on how insurance works, how to rent an apartment, how to set up utilities, what to expect when buying a car and all those other things that I ended up doing for the first time on my own within a year so of getting out of college. I'm not certain exactly how to teach that type of stuff, but if there was a way, it would have been useful to me and many of my friends. I think probably the best way to learn these type of lessons is for kids to be involved in the management of the household when they're growing up. Looking back I can now see that household chores are as much about learning how to run a household as they are about sharing the workload.

01-15-2008, 05:51 PM	#33
beansac Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Chicago Posts: 32 Reputation: (13)	In my school, it is mandatory, but the teachers include 1) A man who doesn't know the difference between their and they're, which is the best way to explain his personal finance knowledge. 2) A man who put himself into so much debt he had to move back in with his parents, then teaches finance, and doesn't know what volatility is ("does it mean disgusting" and that isn't an anecdote.) He didn't know that America didn't always have an income tax, or that the money supply is controlled by the government (and private banks.) Unfortunately, there isn't much financial motivation to transfer from being a financial advisor to being a public school teacher. Most are busy making money. As the quote goes "All the astronauts are in space."

01-15-2008, 10:19 PM	#34
gspencer Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: California Posts: 6 Reputation: (10)	Hmm... my school was very different than most I guess because we did learn about finances in school! Not that I think every student got as much out of it as I did... or that I remember everything from them... but I do distincly remember taking the classes. The first class was half a semester and attached to the Driver's Education class (which everyone signs up for, obviously). We learned how to look for a job in the classifies, write a resume and apply for a job. I think we even talked about how to ask for a certain amount of compensation on how to get more (ie: when applying for a standard retail Mall job, put a higher amount than minimum wage and say that it's negotiable). In this class, we also learned how to balance a checkbook. There was probably more, but that's all I can remember. And then the second class that I think is actually a required class (at least in California) for seniors is Economics. Now it might have just been my teacher, who I recall as being very strict but very good... but we actually learned about bonds and stocks and micro and macro-economics. I even remember a project where we all got a certain amount of class "money" (imaginary money), something like $500 and we could invest in any stocks we'd like. Then over the course of a couple weeks we tracked the progress of our stocks and figured out how much we were actually "making". I think the winners (whoever made the most at the end of the specified period) got something ... extra credit points or a giftcard or something. So maybe my high school was just good about teaching some financial basics, because it doesn't sound like a lot of people had much at their high school.

01-20-2008, 02:19 PM	#36
Linsey Knerl Wise Bread Blogger Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 76 Reputation: (25)	I think they should teach more PF in schools. When I was in HS (over 10 years ago), they touched on it in a "modern Living" class -- fancy word for Home Ec. It was a goof-off class to pass the Senior year away. We discussed how to write a check one day, and other than that, it was how to cook from a recipe and how to put a condom on a banana. I certainly think if schools can hand out birth control, it wouldn't be out of line to show them the basics of interest rates and EFT deductions. That's why we are trying to be more diligent about it with our home school curriculum. There is no way I'm letting my kids find out about the pitfalls of bad money decisions on a trial basis. I hope that if schools can't find it in their budgets that a good non-profit will step up and do something for the school-age children.

01-20-2008, 02:29 PM	#37
72Tiger Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Knoxville, TN Posts: 296 Reputation: (38)	Finance is such a personal subject. Not as much as religion, but close, I would think. What version would you want taught in school? What if they taught your kids something you disagreed with? That said, it would be nice if it could be done - I learned too many financial lessons the hard way.

01-27-2008, 10:33 AM	#40
khorrell Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 424 Reputation: (60)	What a great post...this is a subject I am very interested in and I've learned a lot from reading your posts. It is clear that there are barriers to teaching pf in high school, particularly the AP, IB factor. I'm just appalled to hear that there are unqualified people teaching pf - exactly the opposite of useful. I look forward to reading more of this post!