While it's true that American consumerism has been the driving force of the World economy, that it becoming less so as more and more countries begin spending the money that Americans have exported to them. The American model, however, is unsustainable, and soon our massive debt will haunt countries dependant upon the American desire for Wal-Mart specials. If America suddenly began spending less, then there would be economic upheaval, it's true, but less so than most would believe. Other consumers would certainly pick up the slack.
By spending less, Americans wouldn't need to make as much. A sudden shift in spending would result in large job losses, especially in the service industry. But by spending less, the low paying service jobs would no longer be needed to supplement income. Single income families would become commonplace, as would single vehicle families, single home families, single marriage families. Consumerism affects so many things in our lives, I'm not sure we understand just how damaging it is.
There have always been people who will reneg on their promises, as well as people who will make commitments that they end up being unable to keep (due to foolishness or bad luck).
You see it more in two circumstances.
First, when people are anonymous. If you live in a village of just 50 or 100 people, half of whom are related in some way, the consequences of being known as a cheater or a loser is pretty bad. (Even being known as the parents, spouse, siblings, or children of a cheater or a loser is bad, so they'll step in to cover for a relative who has made a commitment but is in danger of failing.)
Second, when people are in a position of power. If everybody's roughly equal, you see less cheating than if one person owns all the land or all the water rights, or if the judgets are corrupt.
The US tends to be bad on the first--there are so many people, and they're so mobile, it's easy to be anonymous. The US isn't so bad on the second--there's less corruption than many places--but the US legal system is too slow, too expensive, and too unpredictable to be really useful for settling the sort of small legal dispute that would arise from something like this. Better to stick to using it within smaller subcommunities where people's reputations are worth preserving.
There's a easier way to do a u-turn on a bike then using the counterweight technique. You put the rear brake on and use the clutch plus revs to help keep the bike more stable. Trust me it works very well. The revs give the bike stability and clutch to control the bike's power. I will try the counterweight technique, haven't learned about that. Only got my bike yesterday and it's so fun and dangerous at the same time if you read the stats.
I'm still very much new to it all and the LOOK WHERE YOU WANT TO GO mantra is something I'm still trying to get over. I find it very interesting. Keep the good luck up.
Amazon and half.com only allow US resident to sell books online, in fact, NEW international edition books outside US are much cheaper, usually half price of hard cover, but content is exactly the same. I think paperback is ok if you just read it for 1 or 2 semesters. Before buying at Amazon or half.com, I suggest that we can find some booksellers outsides US, for example, some ebay booksellers locate in Asia can offer a cheaper book price with shipping.
we will see how well the economic stimulus package helps us later in the year. while we are getting a boost in spending confidence now, what will happen later in the year when the stimulus money is all gone.
i have been blogging about this for the past month and i will continue my year long mission to blog about the economic stimulus package. 600 dollars divided by 365 days is a buck64aday.
i am the help the goverment never though they would get. I am spendning my stimulus a buck64aday.
iPosty, you are not alone. I know my husband would never do that to me. However, perhaps the author did not accurately convey how it all came about. Perhaps she initiated the topic and he was actually supporting her by making that offer?
Anyway, I'm grateful that my husband (a hunk with "love handles") has never said one hurtful thing about me being overweight. He is only supportive of my getting more healthy and only comments on it from this angle. And usually he doesn't comment on it at all.
I did business with a large company and we had an agreement that they breached. Contracts in America mean nothing if the courts don't back them when the one who signed it decides to breach it.
I seriously doubt anyone in America trusts anyone else enough to do something like this. There are too many scams where people (especially senior citizens) lose their money.
I am looking for ways to raise money to start a business, but I couldn't trust enough to do it this way...assuming I could make that much in a month to hand it out like that.
My dad raised sheep when we were growing up. It's alot of work, but there is a reward. Because they aren't the brightest animal, we seemed to always be dealing with them. :)
I like the book because it really is an honest guide to farm living. The reviews on amazon (all 2) were negative because they said the book wasn't comprehensive enough. With all the topics it covers, how could it be? But it's great if you're looking at different aspects of the lifestyle and want to see which ones you may be compatible with before you invest more time, money, and resource (including the indepth books.)
If you're looking for a step-by-step, this book isnt it. But when you're read to take on sheep, I have some great resources for you.
I think this is a great idea. There are so many things that are nickel, diming and 35% interest-ing people to death, anything that removes that outside greed factor puts people ahead.
I would love to see more co-op situations to help get people into homes, access affordable food and those kinds of things.
I see the risk in something like this a far better option than people who have used high interest fee ridden credit cards to try to launch a business.
Throughout most of history, all over the world, family enterprises have been so normal and natural that it's only been in the past few hundred years that it was even possible to do otherwise. Whether the business was a farm or a mill or a shop, the (male) head of the household owned it and everyone else worked in it.
Families have had business disasters throughout history, of course, and they often caused family estrangement to some degree. But, because almost nobody was rich enough to just say, "Screw this--I'll strike out on my own," families usually worked things out.
Yeah, I thought of that too. If you increased the amount by just $1 per month (so that the contribution was $501 the second month and $511 in the last month) that would make the last person entirely whole--he could have gotten $6083 by saving up the money in a savings account (assuming 3% interest), but he'll get $6132 this way. On the other hand, the simplicity and obvious even-handedness of going with equal amounts every month are also an advantage.
i just spent the most enjoyable 1/2 hour reading all these comments...I had a crease like dent removed by a dent place...a little ripple left in the paint..but you have to know where to look...i have alittle one in the door. If i could just get my spatula in there....but the plunger...love the liquid wood discussion....thank you all for a good time.. cheaper than Atlantic City.....
As someone who has started a number of businesses, I have an ironclad rule born out of experience.
Do not go into business with a friend or family member. It's a recipe for disaster. You will most likely end up losing a friend or becoming estranged from a family member.
Maybe to offset the disadvantage of being a recipient towards the end of list, the amount of each contribution should go up slightly each month. So that way there's an obvious time-money tradeoff. You can get your payout sooner, but you get less. Or get the money later but get a little extra, like a typical interest-bearing product.
The system has all the risks that you mention. They loom a bit large, mostly because we're so used to systems where much of the risk has been removed. I don't personally know anyone who has lost money in a bank failure, for example, but that's due to modern innovations like bank regulation and deposit insurance. For times and places where the banks were risky, a scheme like this might well be just as a secure as saving the money up in a bank.
It's also a good example of the importance of cultural support. If this is a familiar system that everyone uses and everyone thinks is important, then coming up short would be the sort of big deal where you could lean on your friends and relations to make up the difference. Saying, "The check from my biggest customer hasn't arrived, can you spot me $500," might draw just sneers, but saying "The check from my biggest customer hasn't arrived, and I'm due to make my contribution to my ROSCA tonight," might have your family digging into the cookie jar and your employees promising not to cash their paychecks for a few days.
Not to rain on anyone's parade, what if the first person fails? What if they don't make enough in the first month or even the first year so that the next person can have their share of the money (and very few new businesses make money immediately) The failure rate of new businesses are very high, and this arrangement doesn't seem to give protection for that possibility. You could not only end up in Small Claims Court, but also lose some of your friends in that eventuality.
And it's not that I don't believe in communal sharing. I give regularly to Kiva to provide small loans to start ups to people who otherwise might not be able to support their businesses. But that is $25 I can afford, rather than $500 a month! (I'm quoting you: "At every meeting, each one contributes $500.")
I would think long and hard before getting involved in such a scheme.
The legal structure of an arrangement like this seems to be somewhat unclear in the US. I saw one reference to a case that went to court where the judge refused to enforce any obligation, calling it an "illegal lottery," presumably based on the fact that the person who got the money each time was based on a random draw from among the people who hadn't gotten it yet.
That particular issue could probably be dealt with by not having the random draw at the meeting, but instead doing it up-front and making a list of who got the money when. Of course, knowing that they were going to come last might make the people at the end of the list less interested in participating. (There would be an up-side to knowing the order in advance, though--knowing when they would get their money would make it possible for members to get the wheels turning on their new business--finding a store front, making arrangements with suppliers and employees, etc.)
It would almost certainly be possible to create a proper legal structure--probably setting the whole thing up as a trust, and having the trust sign a contract with each member. It would probably also be possible to get insurance for the trust to protect against members who were unable to contribute (as well those who just didn't want to pay their share).
I think this is a fabulous way for people to go about getting started with a business and would probably make all those involved a lot more committed to the communities in which they live and operate their business.
I personally wouldn't mind attempting something like this if I had any inclination as to the kind of business I want to start...
America needs things like this to give it more community centered spirit and attitude. Too often we tend to treat our fellow Americans like their the enemy... which is often perpetrated by the stereotypical media showing us how awful we all are...
My question is what are the legal ramifications of reneging on the arrangement in the US?
Dont under estimate your own art for decorating. Your own art on the wall is a kick start every day. Especially if your not that artistic to begin with. Look at these ideas http://www.canvaspress.com/ideas_gallery.html
I agree with Jeff that adding frozen veggies is a quick way of stretching meals. For instance, when the writer mentioned ordering one dish of curry for two people, but making extra rice at home, she could add a bag of frozen veggies to the rice cooking water (toward the end of the cooking) for no extra effort or cleanup, and add good nutrition and bulk.
Another simple addition is fruit. Cutting up a couple of apples is easy and nutritious. Easier yet, a bowl of grapes. Don't even have to cut them up. And it's good for you!
I do agree that a chest freezer could eliminate this problem, however, for us it wouldn't work too well (I need access to many things that would just get "buried" in a chest freezer.) But I'm considering getting one for my 2nd freezer.
Air vent = evaporator coils... You're right. The verbage was taken from the extension office. Maybe they assumed not everyone would know what the coils are? (I only know that you're supposed to dust them from time to time.) :)
As for the bread, I think that it is a good idea for both. If the frozen loaf you were storing in the freezer thaws out, I dont' think you're supposed to refreeze it. (It can make the bread dry and taste funny.) And the frozen dough is just nasty if you let it thaw improperly and then bake it!
I'm a huge fan of keeping a wide variety of frozen vegtables in the freezer and using them to stretch semi-prepared, quick meals. For instance, bags of chopped broccoli are 97 cents for a 16oz (1 pound) bag at the Super Target where we shop. They recently had several varieties of those new Bertolli frozen skillet meals on sale 2-for-12dollars. I'll cook up the "Chicken, Rigatoni, and Broccoli" Bertolli bag, and add a 1/2 pound more of chopped frozen broccoli. This yields enough to feed a family of four, and makes it healthier in the process because you're diluting a finite amount of salt, fat, etc. with straight-up veggies. Another example is if I'm making mexican food, I'll buy those cans of Spanish Rice from La Preferida when they're on sale, and mix one can with 2 cups (prepared) of plain long grain white rice. There is so much salt (2790mg) and spices in the can to begin with that I couldn't imagine actually eating it "straight" without diluting it with an equal volume of plain white rice. My last trick is this: Guys, I know how it always seems like there's never enough food is those frozen dinners. Again, keep veggies in the freezer and augment whatever veggie came with the frozen dinner. If your entre has peas as the veggie, add more peas. If your entre has carrots, add some more frozen carrots. Eat a bite of meatloaf (or whatever it is), then a bite of carrots, etc., repeat, and when you're done you'll feel more satisfied and be less likely to heat up another one!!!!
While it's true that American consumerism has been the driving force of the World economy, that it becoming less so as more and more countries begin spending the money that Americans have exported to them. The American model, however, is unsustainable, and soon our massive debt will haunt countries dependant upon the American desire for Wal-Mart specials. If America suddenly began spending less, then there would be economic upheaval, it's true, but less so than most would believe. Other consumers would certainly pick up the slack.
By spending less, Americans wouldn't need to make as much. A sudden shift in spending would result in large job losses, especially in the service industry. But by spending less, the low paying service jobs would no longer be needed to supplement income. Single income families would become commonplace, as would single vehicle families, single home families, single marriage families. Consumerism affects so many things in our lives, I'm not sure we understand just how damaging it is.
There have always been people who will reneg on their promises, as well as people who will make commitments that they end up being unable to keep (due to foolishness or bad luck).
You see it more in two circumstances.
First, when people are anonymous. If you live in a village of just 50 or 100 people, half of whom are related in some way, the consequences of being known as a cheater or a loser is pretty bad. (Even being known as the parents, spouse, siblings, or children of a cheater or a loser is bad, so they'll step in to cover for a relative who has made a commitment but is in danger of failing.)
Second, when people are in a position of power. If everybody's roughly equal, you see less cheating than if one person owns all the land or all the water rights, or if the judgets are corrupt.
The US tends to be bad on the first--there are so many people, and they're so mobile, it's easy to be anonymous. The US isn't so bad on the second--there's less corruption than many places--but the US legal system is too slow, too expensive, and too unpredictable to be really useful for settling the sort of small legal dispute that would arise from something like this. Better to stick to using it within smaller subcommunities where people's reputations are worth preserving.
There's a easier way to do a u-turn on a bike then using the counterweight technique. You put the rear brake on and use the clutch plus revs to help keep the bike more stable. Trust me it works very well. The revs give the bike stability and clutch to control the bike's power. I will try the counterweight technique, haven't learned about that. Only got my bike yesterday and it's so fun and dangerous at the same time if you read the stats.
I'm still very much new to it all and the LOOK WHERE YOU WANT TO GO mantra is something I'm still trying to get over. I find it very interesting. Keep the good luck up.
Amazon and half.com only allow US resident to sell books online, in fact, NEW international edition books outside US are much cheaper, usually half price of hard cover, but content is exactly the same. I think paperback is ok if you just read it for 1 or 2 semesters. Before buying at Amazon or half.com, I suggest that we can find some booksellers outsides US, for example, some ebay booksellers locate in Asia can offer a cheaper book price with shipping.
we will see how well the economic stimulus package helps us later in the year. while we are getting a boost in spending confidence now, what will happen later in the year when the stimulus money is all gone.
i have been blogging about this for the past month and i will continue my year long mission to blog about the economic stimulus package. 600 dollars divided by 365 days is a buck64aday.
i am the help the goverment never though they would get. I am spendning my stimulus a buck64aday.
read my story
www.buck64aday.blogspot.com
iPosty, you are not alone. I know my husband would never do that to me. However, perhaps the author did not accurately convey how it all came about. Perhaps she initiated the topic and he was actually supporting her by making that offer?
Anyway, I'm grateful that my husband (a hunk with "love handles") has never said one hurtful thing about me being overweight. He is only supportive of my getting more healthy and only comments on it from this angle. And usually he doesn't comment on it at all.
I did business with a large company and we had an agreement that they breached. Contracts in America mean nothing if the courts don't back them when the one who signed it decides to breach it.
I seriously doubt anyone in America trusts anyone else enough to do something like this. There are too many scams where people (especially senior citizens) lose their money.
I am looking for ways to raise money to start a business, but I couldn't trust enough to do it this way...assuming I could make that much in a month to hand it out like that.
I think I'll put this on my list. Thanks, Linsey.
My dad raised sheep when we were growing up. It's alot of work, but there is a reward. Because they aren't the brightest animal, we seemed to always be dealing with them. :)
I like the book because it really is an honest guide to farm living. The reviews on amazon (all 2) were negative because they said the book wasn't comprehensive enough. With all the topics it covers, how could it be? But it's great if you're looking at different aspects of the lifestyle and want to see which ones you may be compatible with before you invest more time, money, and resource (including the indepth books.)
If you're looking for a step-by-step, this book isnt it. But when you're read to take on sheep, I have some great resources for you.
I think this is a great idea. There are so many things that are nickel, diming and 35% interest-ing people to death, anything that removes that outside greed factor puts people ahead.
I would love to see more co-op situations to help get people into homes, access affordable food and those kinds of things.
I see the risk in something like this a far better option than people who have used high interest fee ridden credit cards to try to launch a business.
Cool!
I think of myself as a connoisseur of such books, but I wasn't aware of this one, and it sounds like a particularly good one. Thanks for the review.
(Sheep are of particular interest to me, because my wife is a spinner.)
@Kelja:
Throughout most of history, all over the world, family enterprises have been so normal and natural that it's only been in the past few hundred years that it was even possible to do otherwise. Whether the business was a farm or a mill or a shop, the (male) head of the household owned it and everyone else worked in it.
Families have had business disasters throughout history, of course, and they often caused family estrangement to some degree. But, because almost nobody was rich enough to just say, "Screw this--I'll strike out on my own," families usually worked things out.
@George:
Yeah, I thought of that too. If you increased the amount by just $1 per month (so that the contribution was $501 the second month and $511 in the last month) that would make the last person entirely whole--he could have gotten $6083 by saving up the money in a savings account (assuming 3% interest), but he'll get $6132 this way. On the other hand, the simplicity and obvious even-handedness of going with equal amounts every month are also an advantage.
There are obviously infinite variations possible.
i just spent the most enjoyable 1/2 hour reading all these comments...I had a crease like dent removed by a dent place...a little ripple left in the paint..but you have to know where to look...i have alittle one in the door. If i could just get my spatula in there....but the plunger...love the liquid wood discussion....thank you all for a good time.. cheaper than Atlantic City.....
As someone who has started a number of businesses, I have an ironclad rule born out of experience.
Do not go into business with a friend or family member. It's a recipe for disaster. You will most likely end up losing a friend or becoming estranged from a family member.
Maybe to offset the disadvantage of being a recipient towards the end of list, the amount of each contribution should go up slightly each month. So that way there's an obvious time-money tradeoff. You can get your payout sooner, but you get less. Or get the money later but get a little extra, like a typical interest-bearing product.
The system has all the risks that you mention. They loom a bit large, mostly because we're so used to systems where much of the risk has been removed. I don't personally know anyone who has lost money in a bank failure, for example, but that's due to modern innovations like bank regulation and deposit insurance. For times and places where the banks were risky, a scheme like this might well be just as a secure as saving the money up in a bank.
It's also a good example of the importance of cultural support. If this is a familiar system that everyone uses and everyone thinks is important, then coming up short would be the sort of big deal where you could lean on your friends and relations to make up the difference. Saying, "The check from my biggest customer hasn't arrived, can you spot me $500," might draw just sneers, but saying "The check from my biggest customer hasn't arrived, and I'm due to make my contribution to my ROSCA tonight," might have your family digging into the cookie jar and your employees promising not to cash their paychecks for a few days.
Not to rain on anyone's parade, what if the first person fails? What if they don't make enough in the first month or even the first year so that the next person can have their share of the money (and very few new businesses make money immediately) The failure rate of new businesses are very high, and this arrangement doesn't seem to give protection for that possibility. You could not only end up in Small Claims Court, but also lose some of your friends in that eventuality.
And it's not that I don't believe in communal sharing. I give regularly to Kiva to provide small loans to start ups to people who otherwise might not be able to support their businesses. But that is $25 I can afford, rather than $500 a month! (I'm quoting you: "At every meeting, each one contributes $500.")
I would think long and hard before getting involved in such a scheme.
The legal structure of an arrangement like this seems to be somewhat unclear in the US. I saw one reference to a case that went to court where the judge refused to enforce any obligation, calling it an "illegal lottery," presumably based on the fact that the person who got the money each time was based on a random draw from among the people who hadn't gotten it yet.
That particular issue could probably be dealt with by not having the random draw at the meeting, but instead doing it up-front and making a list of who got the money when. Of course, knowing that they were going to come last might make the people at the end of the list less interested in participating. (There would be an up-side to knowing the order in advance, though--knowing when they would get their money would make it possible for members to get the wheels turning on their new business--finding a store front, making arrangements with suppliers and employees, etc.)
It would almost certainly be possible to create a proper legal structure--probably setting the whole thing up as a trust, and having the trust sign a contract with each member. It would probably also be possible to get insurance for the trust to protect against members who were unable to contribute (as well those who just didn't want to pay their share).
I think this is a fabulous way for people to go about getting started with a business and would probably make all those involved a lot more committed to the communities in which they live and operate their business.
I personally wouldn't mind attempting something like this if I had any inclination as to the kind of business I want to start...
America needs things like this to give it more community centered spirit and attitude. Too often we tend to treat our fellow Americans like their the enemy... which is often perpetrated by the stereotypical media showing us how awful we all are...
My question is what are the legal ramifications of reneging on the arrangement in the US?
Dont under estimate your own art for decorating. Your own art on the wall is a kick start every day. Especially if your not that artistic to begin with. Look at these ideas
http://www.canvaspress.com/ideas_gallery.html
I agree with Jeff that adding frozen veggies is a quick way of stretching meals. For instance, when the writer mentioned ordering one dish of curry for two people, but making extra rice at home, she could add a bag of frozen veggies to the rice cooking water (toward the end of the cooking) for no extra effort or cleanup, and add good nutrition and bulk.
Another simple addition is fruit. Cutting up a couple of apples is easy and nutritious. Easier yet, a bowl of grapes. Don't even have to cut them up. And it's good for you!
I do agree that a chest freezer could eliminate this problem, however, for us it wouldn't work too well (I need access to many things that would just get "buried" in a chest freezer.) But I'm considering getting one for my 2nd freezer.
Air vent = evaporator coils... You're right. The verbage was taken from the extension office. Maybe they assumed not everyone would know what the coils are? (I only know that you're supposed to dust them from time to time.) :)
As for the bread, I think that it is a good idea for both. If the frozen loaf you were storing in the freezer thaws out, I dont' think you're supposed to refreeze it. (It can make the bread dry and taste funny.) And the frozen dough is just nasty if you let it thaw improperly and then bake it!
Thanks for the added advice!
A chest freezer is more efficient than an upright, and much less likely to have the door come ajar. :)
There is no "air vent" in either a chest or upright freezer - I think that means "don't block the evaporator coils with a blanket"
As for bread - I freeze bread store bread - I think that section in your article is referring to frozen dough, not baked bread.
I'm a huge fan of keeping a wide variety of frozen vegtables in the freezer and using them to stretch semi-prepared, quick meals. For instance, bags of chopped broccoli are 97 cents for a 16oz (1 pound) bag at the Super Target where we shop. They recently had several varieties of those new Bertolli frozen skillet meals on sale 2-for-12dollars. I'll cook up the "Chicken, Rigatoni, and Broccoli" Bertolli bag, and add a 1/2 pound more of chopped frozen broccoli. This yields enough to feed a family of four, and makes it healthier in the process because you're diluting a finite amount of salt, fat, etc. with straight-up veggies. Another example is if I'm making mexican food, I'll buy those cans of Spanish Rice from La Preferida when they're on sale, and mix one can with 2 cups (prepared) of plain long grain white rice. There is so much salt (2790mg) and spices in the can to begin with that I couldn't imagine actually eating it "straight" without diluting it with an equal volume of plain white rice. My last trick is this: Guys, I know how it always seems like there's never enough food is those frozen dinners. Again, keep veggies in the freezer and augment whatever veggie came with the frozen dinner. If your entre has peas as the veggie, add more peas. If your entre has carrots, add some more frozen carrots. Eat a bite of meatloaf (or whatever it is), then a bite of carrots, etc., repeat, and when you're done you'll feel more satisfied and be less likely to heat up another one!!!!