People often use the shapes of letters to describe the shape of recessions:
The "V" shaped recession has a sharp bottom where the economy bottoms out and then growth promptly resumes.
The "U" shaped recession has a decline that bottoms out, but then remains at that low level for some period before growth resumes.
The "L" shaped recession has a decline that bottoms out, but then remains at a low level for an extended period--long enough that people wonder if growth will ever resume again.
My statement about the bottom merely being the end of things getting worse was intended to warn of the possibiity of the U or L shaped recessions.
I find tracking spending is much easier with my Amex than cash. I can go online anytime and see exactly what I've spent on each of my budgeted categories.
Since I pay the bill every month, I consider myself to be more of a charge card user than a credit card user. I get rewards for my purchases, which is like getting an additional discount on everything I buy. And using credit responsibly has resulted in a high FICO, which saves me a great deal in mortagage interest each year. Hence, I consider my rewards card a more frugal choice than cash.
I don't really understand people who use cash-only as a budgeting tool. Seems like a great way to run out of money before running out of month (how do you track where it goes? I find it just kind of evaporates...). Still, congrats on getting yourself out of CC debt and finding an approach that works for you!
"This could very likely mean a recession where the bottom is not so much the beginning of the recovery but just the end of things getting worse"
If you hit a cusp (e.g. -- the actual bottom, not a local min) then by definition you are recovering (.e. -- positive derivative). The statement above does not make any sense. Restated, the end of things getting worse is the same as things getting better (e.g. -- recovery)
Another poster stated:
"And, btw, there use to be a time honored way for consumers to quickly eliminate credit card debt. It was called bankruptcy. Thanks to Bush and the Republicans, that option is not nearly as available. That'll have a lengthening effect on this recession for sure."
I suppose it would be too obvious to point out that consumers filing bankruptcy does not eliminate credit card debit, it just transfers it from one party to another. This sort of borrowing mentality is largely responsible for why the real estate crash happened in the first place. If the borrowers learned how to read and had any financial sense, they could:
a) Realize they were in a variable ARM that could balloon in their face
b) Realize that sound financial practice dictates that mortgages should not be more than 35% of monthly income.
The combination of these two simple techniques would protect consumers. Sure, the banks are responsible for giving money out to people who could not afford it, and in an ideal capitalistic world, their reward would be no more business and completely depleted resources, instead of mortgaging taxpayer dollars to pay their debt.
Unfortunately both reading comprehension and common sense, along with personal responsibility seem to be in short supply in our country. Witness how our beg borrow and steal works... we are effectively allowing the "banks" to file for bankruptcy at the taxpayer expense, but the taxpayers need to borrow from other nations and increasing our national debt to pay our banks. If you're curious what a real depression will look like, it will happen when we try to get money from other countries and they start saying "no".
I love to cook and because I'm a student, then I really like things that have multiple uses, or are durable and good, or different. Whenever I go to a garage sale or tag sale or flea market, I love browsing through old cookbooks especially when their original owner(s) earmarked pages or wrote in notes. I think it would be great to get a book that had say 101 Favorite Classic Family Recipes all made from those old family recipes and cookbooks. Don't you? I mean, they were just made differently than the box mixes and prepared and semi-prepared or totally frozen stuff we get today, you know?
I like the idea because I am a graduate student and it seems I am forever needing to move ~ from a dorm to an apartment to another dorm...and that's meant packing and unpacking and finding furniture to fit my new space and getting friends to help me move. You know how that is - especially when there are front steps to go up and down and friends are hauling beds and tables and things. Good thing I can cook up a storm! Went to the House and Garden show recently and saw a similarly neat product called Featherweight Furniture. It's really comfortable, durable (safe from my kitten's sharp claws) and portable. See what you think: http://www.featherweightfurniture.com I have a love seat and the fact that it's got easy access, out of sight extra storage is cool.
If I want to put the IPMT and PPMT function for the following, what would the formula look like?
I'm having problems with IPMT functions and can't get the correct answer. Loan $750,000, Annual Rate 7.50%, Years 5, Periods per year 4, Rate per Period 1.88%, Number of Periods 20, Period Payment (PMT) is ($45,316) I need to be able to calculate the Interest Payment. Then I need to find the PPMT function to calculate the principal payment for the current payment period. Please help!
These ideas make sense regardless of the state of the economy.
I particularly love the idea of borrowing and renting. It's hard to do in a big city where neighbors are not necessarily friendly or open to sharing or where friends don't live close enough to borrow things that can't be transported via subway or bus.
Even in this economy, there are still far too many people who are resistant to sharing and conserving resources via the methods you mentioned and that's just sad, not to mention wasteful.
For most of us, it takes a huge event to get us to wake up to what we really need versus what we've been conditioned to want.
We didn't enter the world with a lust for stuff. It's acquired via the influence of our society (and very few are immune; most people have at least one area where they "gotta have" stuff).
It's even harder these days, again, despite the economy, depending on your community or social and professional circles, to practice a "less is more" approach to living.
It isn't being frugal to follow the ideas you explored. It's about being resourceful.
And you have to be vigilant. Stuff creeps up on you and what often starts as buying just one thing...leads to more and more and more.
Many of us do not do drugs, drink, smoke or overeat. But we do have addictions to stuff, whether it's books, electronics, home decorating or cars.
What we have to remember is that the more stuff we have and/or want, the more we are slaves to it.
Reason enough to give pause before purchasing anything.
I had to figure out a substitute this week when our dryer conked out on us with 2 loads of laundry done and wet. I hung everything over our porch railings in the front and back of the house. Thank goodness it was a sunny week so everything dried! I had thought about borrowing my neighbors dryer but I kind of liked doing this better.
I am very glad to be getting my dryer back on Monday however.
And no - I don't have a clothes line nor a place to put one really.
Tisha, it sounds like you already made that transition, so this post should be called something more like "How using cash taught me a valuable lesson" or something like that.
Sounds to me like you're ready to use your card in a responsible way and take advantage of the perks of using a credit card.
My 78 year old Dad has been scammed out of his life savings, his entire reverse mortgage amount and left with $70k of credit card debts. My Mom asked me to take care of his finances shortly before she passed away 2 years ago but he refused my offers for help and became secretive and evasive with his finances. He gave it away willingly to overseas scammers. Specifically Spanish lottery, Jamaica (phone calls), Canadian (check in mail) scams. They still call every day to scam him out of his monthly pension check. I overheard one of the scammers and he sounded like a nice elderly man who could be your grandfather. My Dad still believes he is going to receive millions and these people are honest (except the Canadian guy who stole the money from the credit cards). His Publishers Clearing House tickets sit next to his chair and he waits all day for them to show up when they have a drawing. I play the role of your Aunt trying to stop the insanity but it is damaging my relationship with my father. I always assumed my Dad would have plenty of money for assisted living and whatever else he needed. It is all gone. Legally there is nothing I can do without his permission. I would need a doctor to declare him mentally incompetent to take over his finances. He called me today and needed $150 to make a credit card payment. He said if he didn't give them the money they would take away his credit card and give it to someone else. I had to refuse my own Dad a $150 loan because I can't believe a word he says. What is the moral of this story? These evil overseas scammers go through the obituaries and target the elderly. They will continue to scam our elderly until governments, honest politicians, bank officials and law enforcement can work together to stop this insanity.
wow where is the proof, once again another person on the net slandering people because they are phucking leftist pigs afraid of others making more money, guess what, you got your way Obama is president and you loose your freedoms. hope you get what you wanted!
@Guest: Many of the snake oil salespersons I've seen are extremely crafty with their wording but don't have the simple results to back it up. It seems so obvious, but as I've alluded to, in the heat of a sales pitch, easy for the human mind to ignore. I agree it's sad and amusing, like some twisted game!
@Norilyn: Exactly. I welcome info about new tools but if I don't find them useful and say "no", I don't want to be continually spammed and sales-pitched to.
@Steve: That's a lot of experience! I always look forward to what new iterations of technology will both assist and cripple human voices amidst all the dataglut today — it's an arms race of the scam-catchers vs. the scammers.
@Tisha: You are most welcome! I'll check out your blog. :)
GREAT point about "opinion leader" — as enviable as it seems at first to get "free" goodies, even on a temporary borrow-basis, there's always the reciprocal pressure of having to do something in return. And it especially sucks if you get stuff that you didn't find useful and you get hammered to give a favorable testimonial (in addition to being saddled with it), when that wouldn't be honest.
Moral of the story: remain free of debt, not just financially but creatively!
It arrived today from PowerMax. Very happy with how it was packed — even with them upping the RAM, they managed to re-wrap it without signs of wear, and it felt very pristine.
Besides the initial setup experience (an overall smooth one 'cept for Migration Assistant hanging on me), it's been working well so far. Let's see how it fares in the days ahead.
Let me know if you have any questions and/or curiosities. :)
Thanks for the great post, and the recipe. Can't wait to try it. My grandmother used to clip out recipes from newspapers and magazines and then paste them into a notebook. I'll have to ask her if I can see some of her old recipes. I'm also particularly fond of old cookbooks put together by church groups. They always have such a great collection of frugal family-style recipes.
Thanks again,
ShoppingThrifty.com - Ideas for Frugal Living
I just had a quesion about the channels.I have three children and I was wondering are there any channels for kids.My kids dont watch alot but I want them to have something.Thanks Wanda
In case anyone is still stumbling across this post, I wanted to link to where I posted all my emails exchanged between the company and me. The emails are in the comments section:
The range of things that you can substitute for stuff that you don't have is so huge I couldn't begin to scratch the surface--and yet kind of idiosyncratic. (I'd be hard-pressed to get by without an oven, because we bake bread at least once a week, but I'm sure we're making do with substitutes for things that other people couldn't imagine getting along without. For example, we don't have a microwave.)
Examples like these are a great way to get people thinking their own creative thoughts. Thanks!
Ten months ago we moved into a rental house without appliances. We bought a refrigerator but were able to get a free stove--the only catch was that the oven didn't work. The cooktop was fine, though. We cook three meals a day at home most days, so I was convinced we couldn't get by without an oven. However, we quickly learned to make do what we already owned--a toaster oven, bread machine, and crockpot. We did purchase a $40 electric roaster oven around Thanksgiving, but that's far cheaper than a new stove. We recently bought a house that has a built-in oven in great working order, so by learning to do without for a few months, we saved ourselves several hundred dollars.
@Guest:
People often use the shapes of letters to describe the shape of recessions:
My statement about the bottom merely being the end of things getting worse was intended to warn of the possibiity of the U or L shaped recessions.
I think you can "spare" one!
None of this applies to me, but kudos on a well written and HILARIOUS piece. You rock.
I find tracking spending is much easier with my Amex than cash. I can go online anytime and see exactly what I've spent on each of my budgeted categories.
Since I pay the bill every month, I consider myself to be more of a charge card user than a credit card user. I get rewards for my purchases, which is like getting an additional discount on everything I buy. And using credit responsibly has resulted in a high FICO, which saves me a great deal in mortagage interest each year. Hence, I consider my rewards card a more frugal choice than cash.
I don't really understand people who use cash-only as a budgeting tool. Seems like a great way to run out of money before running out of month (how do you track where it goes? I find it just kind of evaporates...). Still, congrats on getting yourself out of CC debt and finding an approach that works for you!
The original author stated:
"This could very likely mean a recession where the bottom is not so much the beginning of the recovery but just the end of things getting worse"
If you hit a cusp (e.g. -- the actual bottom, not a local min) then by definition you are recovering (.e. -- positive derivative). The statement above does not make any sense. Restated, the end of things getting worse is the same as things getting better (e.g. -- recovery)
Another poster stated:
"And, btw, there use to be a time honored way for consumers to quickly eliminate credit card debt. It was called bankruptcy. Thanks to Bush and the Republicans, that option is not nearly as available. That'll have a lengthening effect on this recession for sure."
I suppose it would be too obvious to point out that consumers filing bankruptcy does not eliminate credit card debit, it just transfers it from one party to another. This sort of borrowing mentality is largely responsible for why the real estate crash happened in the first place. If the borrowers learned how to read and had any financial sense, they could:
a) Realize they were in a variable ARM that could balloon in their face
b) Realize that sound financial practice dictates that mortgages should not be more than 35% of monthly income.
The combination of these two simple techniques would protect consumers. Sure, the banks are responsible for giving money out to people who could not afford it, and in an ideal capitalistic world, their reward would be no more business and completely depleted resources, instead of mortgaging taxpayer dollars to pay their debt.
Unfortunately both reading comprehension and common sense, along with personal responsibility seem to be in short supply in our country. Witness how our beg borrow and steal works... we are effectively allowing the "banks" to file for bankruptcy at the taxpayer expense, but the taxpayers need to borrow from other nations and increasing our national debt to pay our banks. If you're curious what a real depression will look like, it will happen when we try to get money from other countries and they start saying "no".
I love to cook and because I'm a student, then I really like things that have multiple uses, or are durable and good, or different. Whenever I go to a garage sale or tag sale or flea market, I love browsing through old cookbooks especially when their original owner(s) earmarked pages or wrote in notes. I think it would be great to get a book that had say 101 Favorite Classic Family Recipes all made from those old family recipes and cookbooks. Don't you? I mean, they were just made differently than the box mixes and prepared and semi-prepared or totally frozen stuff we get today, you know?
I like the idea because I am a graduate student and it seems I am forever needing to move ~ from a dorm to an apartment to another dorm...and that's meant packing and unpacking and finding furniture to fit my new space and getting friends to help me move. You know how that is - especially when there are front steps to go up and down and friends are hauling beds and tables and things. Good thing I can cook up a storm! Went to the House and Garden show recently and saw a similarly neat product called Featherweight Furniture. It's really comfortable, durable (safe from my kitten's sharp claws) and portable. See what you think: http://www.featherweightfurniture.com I have a love seat and the fact that it's got easy access, out of sight extra storage is cool.
If I want to put the IPMT and PPMT function for the following, what would the formula look like?
I'm having problems with IPMT functions and can't get the correct answer. Loan $750,000, Annual Rate 7.50%, Years 5, Periods per year 4, Rate per Period 1.88%, Number of Periods 20, Period Payment (PMT) is ($45,316) I need to be able to calculate the Interest Payment. Then I need to find the PPMT function to calculate the principal payment for the current payment period. Please help!
Thank you.
These ideas make sense regardless of the state of the economy.
I particularly love the idea of borrowing and renting. It's hard to do in a big city where neighbors are not necessarily friendly or open to sharing or where friends don't live close enough to borrow things that can't be transported via subway or bus.
Even in this economy, there are still far too many people who are resistant to sharing and conserving resources via the methods you mentioned and that's just sad, not to mention wasteful.
For most of us, it takes a huge event to get us to wake up to what we really need versus what we've been conditioned to want.
We didn't enter the world with a lust for stuff. It's acquired via the influence of our society (and very few are immune; most people have at least one area where they "gotta have" stuff).
It's even harder these days, again, despite the economy, depending on your community or social and professional circles, to practice a "less is more" approach to living.
It isn't being frugal to follow the ideas you explored. It's about being resourceful.
And you have to be vigilant. Stuff creeps up on you and what often starts as buying just one thing...leads to more and more and more.
Many of us do not do drugs, drink, smoke or overeat. But we do have addictions to stuff, whether it's books, electronics, home decorating or cars.
What we have to remember is that the more stuff we have and/or want, the more we are slaves to it.
Reason enough to give pause before purchasing anything.
I had to figure out a substitute this week when our dryer conked out on us with 2 loads of laundry done and wet. I hung everything over our porch railings in the front and back of the house. Thank goodness it was a sunny week so everything dried! I had thought about borrowing my neighbors dryer but I kind of liked doing this better.
I am very glad to be getting my dryer back on Monday however.
And no - I don't have a clothes line nor a place to put one really.
Tisha, it sounds like you already made that transition, so this post should be called something more like "How using cash taught me a valuable lesson" or something like that.
Sounds to me like you're ready to use your card in a responsible way and take advantage of the perks of using a credit card.
I really like this exercise! What a great way to open up!
What a neat recipe, and a great idea. My father told me his mother would mix stale bread into warmed milk or warmed milk and coffee.
Old cookbooks from the depression era can provide a lot of interesting recipes and reading as well.
My 78 year old Dad has been scammed out of his life savings, his entire reverse mortgage amount and left with $70k of credit card debts. My Mom asked me to take care of his finances shortly before she passed away 2 years ago but he refused my offers for help and became secretive and evasive with his finances. He gave it away willingly to overseas scammers. Specifically Spanish lottery, Jamaica (phone calls), Canadian (check in mail) scams. They still call every day to scam him out of his monthly pension check. I overheard one of the scammers and he sounded like a nice elderly man who could be your grandfather. My Dad still believes he is going to receive millions and these people are honest (except the Canadian guy who stole the money from the credit cards). His Publishers Clearing House tickets sit next to his chair and he waits all day for them to show up when they have a drawing. I play the role of your Aunt trying to stop the insanity but it is damaging my relationship with my father. I always assumed my Dad would have plenty of money for assisted living and whatever else he needed. It is all gone. Legally there is nothing I can do without his permission. I would need a doctor to declare him mentally incompetent to take over his finances. He called me today and needed $150 to make a credit card payment. He said if he didn't give them the money they would take away his credit card and give it to someone else. I had to refuse my own Dad a $150 loan because I can't believe a word he says. What is the moral of this story? These evil overseas scammers go through the obituaries and target the elderly. They will continue to scam our elderly until governments, honest politicians, bank officials and law enforcement can work together to stop this insanity.
wow where is the proof, once again another person on the net slandering people because they are phucking leftist pigs afraid of others making more money, guess what, you got your way Obama is president and you loose your freedoms. hope you get what you wanted!
@Guest: Many of the snake oil salespersons I've seen are extremely crafty with their wording but don't have the simple results to back it up. It seems so obvious, but as I've alluded to, in the heat of a sales pitch, easy for the human mind to ignore. I agree it's sad and amusing, like some twisted game!
@Norilyn: Exactly. I welcome info about new tools but if I don't find them useful and say "no", I don't want to be continually spammed and sales-pitched to.
@Steve: That's a lot of experience! I always look forward to what new iterations of technology will both assist and cripple human voices amidst all the dataglut today — it's an arms race of the scam-catchers vs. the scammers.
@Tisha: You are most welcome! I'll check out your blog. :)
GREAT point about "opinion leader" — as enviable as it seems at first to get "free" goodies, even on a temporary borrow-basis, there's always the reciprocal pressure of having to do something in return. And it especially sucks if you get stuff that you didn't find useful and you get hammered to give a favorable testimonial (in addition to being saddled with it), when that wouldn't be honest.
Moral of the story: remain free of debt, not just financially but creatively!
It arrived today from PowerMax. Very happy with how it was packed — even with them upping the RAM, they managed to re-wrap it without signs of wear, and it felt very pristine.
Besides the initial setup experience (an overall smooth one 'cept for Migration Assistant hanging on me), it's been working well so far. Let's see how it fares in the days ahead.
Let me know if you have any questions and/or curiosities. :)
Thanks for the great post, and the recipe. Can't wait to try it. My grandmother used to clip out recipes from newspapers and magazines and then paste them into a notebook. I'll have to ask her if I can see some of her old recipes. I'm also particularly fond of old cookbooks put together by church groups. They always have such a great collection of frugal family-style recipes.
Thanks again,
ShoppingThrifty.com - Ideas for Frugal Living
I just had a quesion about the channels.I have three children and I was wondering are there any channels for kids.My kids dont watch alot but I want them to have something.Thanks Wanda
Okay, if I can't win this, I am definitely reading it anyway.
In case anyone is still stumbling across this post, I wanted to link to where I posted all my emails exchanged between the company and me. The emails are in the comments section:
https://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=1792693798424726104&postID=3390246506256975508
The reason I'm putting this up here is because I just noticed that Best Buy Worms found this post and is mischaracterizing our communications.
I blog at www.shopliftingwithpermission.com.
The range of things that you can substitute for stuff that you don't have is so huge I couldn't begin to scratch the surface--and yet kind of idiosyncratic. (I'd be hard-pressed to get by without an oven, because we bake bread at least once a week, but I'm sure we're making do with substitutes for things that other people couldn't imagine getting along without. For example, we don't have a microwave.)
Examples like these are a great way to get people thinking their own creative thoughts. Thanks!
Ten months ago we moved into a rental house without appliances. We bought a refrigerator but were able to get a free stove--the only catch was that the oven didn't work. The cooktop was fine, though. We cook three meals a day at home most days, so I was convinced we couldn't get by without an oven. However, we quickly learned to make do what we already owned--a toaster oven, bread machine, and crockpot. We did purchase a $40 electric roaster oven around Thanksgiving, but that's far cheaper than a new stove. We recently bought a house that has a built-in oven in great working order, so by learning to do without for a few months, we saved ourselves several hundred dollars.
Nice post-- sometimes the old ways are the best ways . . .